Ancient Domains Of Mystery, forum overview / ADOM / Heir vs Treasure Hunter
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Soirana Registered user Chaos Freak Last page view: 4152 days, 11 hours, 30 minutes and 10 seconds ago. |
J.:take a note on weight of items you mentioned. for them pick pockets are a lot effective than drops. one fact i'd like to see in Adom is Diablo or Crawl style random artifacts. woulld make these scrolls odf great identify worth something. A root is a flower that disdains fame. Kahlil Gibran(1883-1931) |
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Battle bunny Registered user I'm just that cool Last page view: 5830 days, 2 hours, 30 minutes and 58 seconds ago. |
"LOL, Diablo II sucks." Why do I get the feeling that your avatar sucks more... "woulld make these scrolls odf great identify worth something." The scrolls weren't designed for players who would get a guidebook made to read every single bit of information it. If I didn't have any Internet to get the guidebook from then scrolls of great identify would be nice. (\_/) (o.0) (> <) ( / \ ) Don't click this http://www.mindistortion.net/iwantyoursoul/?i_am=Darkcutter |
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Mewto Registered user Last page view: 3602 days, 8 hours, 35 minutes and 46 seconds ago. |
"Why do I get the feeling that your avatar sucks more..." Hehe, agreed. "If I didn't have any Internet to get the guidebook from then scrolls of great identify would be nice." I play ADOM and have the Guidebook on a flash drive. For the Horde! |
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nOOb-mAsTeR Registered user Master of all things nOOby!!! Last page view: 5766 days, 20 hours, 8 minutes and 37 seconds ago. |
I believe it was silfir who said he doesnt feel too heroic doign scumming, and I agree. I get too damn impatient at endgame, I want that part to be challenging like beginning. All 3 of my wins I feel like a baby about, they were wish engines. Nowadays I get to endgame and have to think of new and original ways to get past obstacles, since I just cant wish for something new, or go scum 300+ stoma so I get some nice artifcats.... I too want my wins to be very satisfying, I intend on making an adom video of me beating game sometime. I find that the best combo for going for speed(not turnwise, but timewise(secs/min/hour) is drakish/healer. You have to think somewhat for early game, but after that, you are speeding like all hell. You fly through ToEf if you went to libarary for ice spells, and quite frankly, TH is useful there. And now I just realized that I managed to ramble on absolutely nothing and went completly off topic>.< If anyone wants to come to my town and kill me, now would be a good time. sighs "You try to give Fang, the large dog the bone. Fang, the large dog says,"Do you know who I am, mortal?!?!" My smartest dog ever:D |
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Silfir Registered user Writer of Overly Long Guides Last page view: 4071 days, 6 hours, 55 minutes and 29 seconds ago. |
Pick pockets is just like gremling scumming. It's great if you keep it up and use it on absolutely everyone that stumbles in your way - but it's horribly tedious. And in the end, somewhat of a bug exploit. I mean, the Pick pockets skill was created at a time when there were no monster inventories, so it *had* to create items out of the air. Now that monster inventories are implemented, the Pick pockets skill should have been redesigned only to affect items the monsters have anyway. It hasn't, which now makes it nothing more but a wondrous item creation skill. I agree with noob-master: Not everything that can make you win the game is there to be done. Everyone has to decide for himself how he wants to play the game and to what lengths he goes to ensure that he wins. If I want to throw my level 50 hurthling barbarian that has closed the gate into the rift with nothing more but a couple gnomish candy, elven bread and his climbing sets, then I do that, because it is fun. I bested a diamond golem in unarmed combat, by the way. *brag* You drop the golden ball. You kick the golden ball. It slides to the west. Suddenly Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, appears! "That's not how you play Quidditch! are you even listening?" Which direction? (123456789) 4 Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is hit by a bolt of acid! Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is annihilated. You hear the ecstatic cries of a large crowd! |
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nOOb-mAsTeR Registered user Master of all things nOOby!!! Last page view: 5766 days, 20 hours, 8 minutes and 37 seconds ago. |
Thanks Silfir^.^ In the end, it all comes down to how bad you want to win, and how much pride you take in your wins. I used to have no shame in making wish engines to get my only 3 wins, how pathetic of me. Now I am pretty dam strict with myself, like: no wish engine no gremlin bomb/scumming of any kind(I used to train pets/companions on gremlins) no pickpocketing unless i'm in a city/town/special npc no ID scumming no herb farming(I just take em all, and leave. if the game was meant to have gardens, they would be in the game) no savescumming obviously hmm...anything else I may have forgotten....oh, no scumming dragon gold no scumming casino by making huge pile I'll never use quickling slaves/killer bug pets ever again, they are like gods in adom yeah, that's about it. the ONLY thing I ever do that I consider 'noobish' is char roll scumming. If I'm sittign down for a couple of hours of adom, I dont wanna spend half my time rolling chars that arent even prepared for stardom. Other than that, I'm pretty much innocent ^.^ I guess you have two extremes: Some players who are willing to do anything/everything in their power to win Few players who wish to make their wins as hard or as fun as possible but of course I cant say for other people what they find fun...but I've been in both situations, and hell, putting restrictions is alot more fun. And I managed to ramble again.Woohoo. "You try to give Fang, the large dog the bone. Fang, the large dog says,"Do you know who I am, mortal?!?!" My smartest dog ever:D |
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J. Registered user You'll never get rid of me Last page view: 5667 days, 1 hour, 7 minutes and 39 seconds ago. |
Soirana: Good point about item weight, didn't really think about that. If you're feeling happy, don't worry, it'll go away. Originally posted by noob: "I'm everytime amazed how you people know to exploit every single little bug (or not-bug) for elaborated scumming tatics even if the feature seems completely useless or bad." |
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Silfir Registered user Writer of Overly Long Guides Last page view: 4071 days, 6 hours, 55 minutes and 29 seconds ago. |
I use gremlin scumming only as a last resort to get amulets of life saving. And I mean last resort. I have played through every dungeon, drained every last pool, checked the water dragon's loot to no avail before I start setting up gremlin bombs in the dwarven graveyard. And if even that doesn't work and I get seriously bored, I let Khelly die. Still won doing that once. I don't do staircase scumming in the ID. I use the stairways to recreate ID:9 so I can explore it completely again and again, but nothing else. Pick pockets I only do to allow myself entry into the thieves guild. Oh, and herbs I do harvest. For food and morgia plus mosses of mareilon, and a basic supply of curaria and alraunia. But I don't hang around for decades to get 300 stomafillia for a precrowning, and I don't abuse sickness and starvation. I haven't precrowned at all for decades. You drop the golden ball. You kick the golden ball. It slides to the west. Suddenly Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, appears! "That's not how you play Quidditch! are you even listening?" Which direction? (123456789) 4 Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is hit by a bolt of acid! Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is annihilated. You hear the ecstatic cries of a large crowd! |
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Battle bunny Registered user I'm just that cool Last page view: 5830 days, 2 hours, 30 minutes and 58 seconds ago. |
I don't give myself such restrictions but I still find myself not gremlin scumming, not pickpocketing everyone etc. I do harvest herbs though, but not really for precrowning and I don't abuse starvation because I'm paranoid and am always afraid of dying via lack of food. The only time I get sick is when I eat a kobold shaman corpse. I don't do dragon scumming because only losers, newbies or people who are trying to experiment should really do it, and because, well, read starvation. I don't do wish engines (and archmages, by the way... unless it really comes in front of me) because if I want infinite wishes I will just use a cheating application and be done with it. (\_/) (o.0) (> <) ( / \ ) Don't click this http://www.mindistortion.net/iwantyoursoul/?i_am=Darkcutter |
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BrasilianWeirdVideos Registered user pron knight Last page view: 5170 days, 3 hours, 45 minutes and 23 seconds ago. |
OT: I agree with you two! :D |
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Mewto Registered user Last page view: 3602 days, 8 hours, 35 minutes and 46 seconds ago. |
I think that gremlin bombs, pick pocketing, and all the others are part of the game. They're not bugs like the piety overflow so why not use them? If you decide not to pick pocket than that's just a restriction, but if you do and win, Jan will still add your char to the HoF. I think TB would have said something about them if they're not supposed to be in the game. Mail him, or something. For the Horde! |
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Soirana Registered user Chaos Freak Last page view: 4152 days, 11 hours, 30 minutes and 10 seconds ago. |
i perfectly understand some people finding fun in certain ways to play. what i do not understand is why these people think they way to play is way better. A root is a flower that disdains fame. Kahlil Gibran(1883-1931) |
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Battle bunny Registered user I'm just that cool Last page view: 5830 days, 2 hours, 30 minutes and 58 seconds ago. |
Now, while I do, for example, consider gremlin scumming as some players' idea of fun, and I accept that, I do think that playing without bug exploiting IS way better than playing with it. Okay, "singleplayer blah blah", but then again the question arises, WHY does Jan add dragon gold-doubled characters in the game? (\_/) (o.0) (> <) ( / \ ) Don't click this http://www.mindistortion.net/iwantyoursoul/?i_am=Darkcutter |
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Soirana Registered user Chaos Freak Last page view: 4152 days, 11 hours, 30 minutes and 10 seconds ago. |
cause, there no ways to detect them? leaving a point i have not seen any argument of yours why dragon gold is bug. I assume you understand naming features you don't like as bugs is not an argument. A root is a flower that disdains fame. Kahlil Gibran(1883-1931) |
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Battle bunny Registered user I'm just that cool Last page view: 5830 days, 2 hours, 30 minutes and 58 seconds ago. |
Because nobody with the slightest bit of a brain would incorporate something that is easy to do, has next to no risks and generates huge profits - I could easily imagine it as a bug in programming though. Now, before you try to excuse yourself out with the Casino, bear in mind that the Casino is well counterweighed by you having to get through those meanies, even if nobody mentions it as a real difficulty - perhaps it could be a bit enhanced though by having time pass as you keep sweeping in cash. And as to your first line, maybe so but I do remember a character which had a S&EF file in which the player clearly wrote that he used the dragon gold doubling... thing. (\_/) (o.0) (> <) ( / \ ) Don't click this http://www.mindistortion.net/iwantyoursoul/?i_am=Darkcutter |
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**cHAoTicChaOs** Registered user Chaotic Awesome Last page view: 5991 days, 28 minutes and 54 seconds ago. |
Dragons Naturally double Gold because of their natural hording tactics. Dragons greed is legendary. Making a Casino Pile i believe is Fine - i do it all the time, and gamble enough to buy what i want, i love shop restocking. .vultuous. |
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Battle bunny Registered user I'm just that cool Last page view: 5830 days, 2 hours, 30 minutes and 58 seconds ago. |
Hoarding tactics =/= gold doubling. Also, to Soirana, another question. Why do you insist on the fact that it's a feature, then? Trying to ease your conscience? (\_/) (o.0) (> <) ( / \ ) Don't click this http://www.mindistortion.net/iwantyoursoul/?i_am=Darkcutter |
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Silfir Registered user Writer of Overly Long Guides Last page view: 4071 days, 6 hours, 55 minutes and 29 seconds ago. |
There are a lot of tricks *inside* the game that can help you win. There is no rule that says you can't use them - but you also shouldn't claim that you're an idiot if you don't. I think nobody wanted to imply either of these two. (And I don't mean "you" as in "one or more of you", but "you" as in "anyone".) There are only two things that should IMHO not be allowed if you want your win to be recorded in the Hall of Fame: Savescumming (duh) and piety overflow. Everything else is fair game. (If anyone wants to argue that piety overflow should be fair game as well, do that in another thread.) So, back to the topic at hand: Treasure Hunter is an awesome talent because it creates more loot for the same number of monsters (and time!). And yes, you can also get the same loot through pickpocketing and killing more monsters - but if you have Treasure Hunter, by killing more monsters you can get EVEN MORE TREASURE! And that's why, in most cases, I'd choose Treasure Hunter over Heir, playing a bard being the only exception. You drop the golden ball. You kick the golden ball. It slides to the west. Suddenly Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, appears! "That's not how you play Quidditch! are you even listening?" Which direction? (123456789) 4 Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is hit by a bolt of acid! Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is annihilated. You hear the ecstatic cries of a large crowd! |
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Soirana Registered user Chaos Freak Last page view: 4152 days, 11 hours, 30 minutes and 10 seconds ago. |
I never insisted on dragon gold being a feature, i rather said it might be a feature. and my conscience is very easy. i use features/bugs i like it and don't really care about other opinions. A root is a flower that disdains fame. Kahlil Gibran(1883-1931) |
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Silfir Registered user Writer of Overly Long Guides Last page view: 4071 days, 6 hours, 55 minutes and 29 seconds ago. |
I agree. Dragon gold might or might not be a feature; calling it a bug is premature given the lack of evidence for that claim. You drop the golden ball. You kick the golden ball. It slides to the west. Suddenly Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, appears! "That's not how you play Quidditch! are you even listening?" Which direction? (123456789) 4 Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is hit by a bolt of acid! Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is annihilated. You hear the ecstatic cries of a large crowd! [Edited 1 time, last edit on 9/25/2007 at 09:35 (GMT -5) by Silfir] |
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Battle bunny Registered user I'm just that cool Last page view: 5830 days, 2 hours, 30 minutes and 58 seconds ago. |
If you don't care about other opinions then why did you post about it in the first place? (\_/) (o.0) (> <) ( / \ ) Don't click this http://www.mindistortion.net/iwantyoursoul/?i_am=Darkcutter |
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Soirana Registered user Chaos Freak Last page view: 4152 days, 11 hours, 30 minutes and 10 seconds ago. |
cause i love stupid discussions in some forums? A root is a flower that disdains fame. Kahlil Gibran(1883-1931) |
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Red October Registered user Last page view: 5675 days, 21 hours, 49 minutes and 20 seconds ago. |
Don't say dragon gold has no risks; I dropped my gold next to a black dragon and took a step to get him to step onto it. Instead of stepping and picking it up he shot acid at me and melted over 10,000 gold pieces. I'd say that's a pretty big risk right there. Battle Bunny: "Ach, maybe his Christian altar was stepped on. By a moloch." |
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**cHAoTicChaOs** Registered user Chaotic Awesome Last page view: 5991 days, 28 minutes and 54 seconds ago. |
I Once Dropped Millions (and millions) and it doubled to someThing like " here is a -84729351623565 gold piece " couldnt pick it up, although i could kick it. .vultuous. |
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jeremiah Registered user Last page view: 5709 days, 20 hours, 59 minutes and 39 seconds ago. |
I always take TH. Main reason - Holy water. I find a good deal more water and I love to bless everything I can. You also find a good deal more booze which has some good uses. TH is good for keeping you well supplied with basic items without having to go out of your way to stay stocked. "THE TH TALENT SUCKS!!!!!!" - Gut |
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Spartan Unregistered user |
Treasure hunter is actually usefull for characters who are generating loot in high levels of danger.Places like blue dragon caves, dwarven graveyard,elemental temples,bunny level,d50,emperor moloch caves,and the like where the loot you generate by killing monsters is high even without scumming and the values of loot are up due to high danger of the dungeon.These dungeons generate more eternium loots than lower metals for examble,well not dwarven graveyard but it is a good examble of the power of treasure hunter when rng works at least normally.The other side how-ever is that other talents can have a more balanced effect throught the hole game. Heir on the other hand gives you an quaranteed item that you can use to survive to the point when you find either a better random loot or an quaranteed item.Mindcrafter for examble probably wears heir item until ancient mummy trappings,wich is probably an armor most use anyway,treasure hunter or not.And Silfirs short of slaying ammo anyways. |
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Spartan Unregistered user |
One thing about that mindcrafter heir gift. pv equals hp for stone traps. |
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