Ancient Domains Of Mystery, forum overview / ADOM / Ranger with two weapon
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Mewto Registered user Last page view: 3606 days, 19 hours, 2 minutes and 20 seconds ago. |
Bickering ~ silly spam :) On some forums I'm a member on, there's a spam topic. Needless to say, it's the biggest topic :P Maybe it wouldn't hurt having one here, too. I guess the closest thing to it would be Suomalaisten oma plaza? For the Horde! |
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Molach Registered user Lord of DurisMud Last page view: 5148 days, 22 hours, 34 minutes and 16 seconds ago. |
Back on track. I think my conclusion was that one weapon is always better than 2. Every 3 games I might find ONE weapon of vampirism, havent ever had two. And that is regardless of weapon type, too. Vampirism and devastation are not comparable, the one will heal you up and make you chaotic, the other deals more damage. A characters equipemnt, level, mission and other considerations would decide which is better. And as such, this forum has been L for a long time now. Don't know who is trying to draw it towards NC here... |
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Jhonka Registered user Kickass player Last page view: 5363 days, 16 hours, 39 minutes and 37 seconds ago. |
One point that i'd like to add to this conversation. The thing that should also be considered is that you are using less energy to deal 2 hits with two weapons instead of one. This means that enemies have less time to spend hitting. Since enemies will hit despite high dv, they now have perhaps only two shots to do so as opposed to three, if only one weapon is used. So we've just cut the amount of swings, with a certain possibility to hit, by a factor of 1/3. What i'm saying is that high dv is not always better. But what totally sinks the usability of shields is the fact that even a simple scythe is better than most of the one handed weapons. When fighting enemies with high dv, a difference of 10 in damage is *very* significant. |
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J. Registered user You'll never get rid of me Last page view: 5671 days, 11 hours, 34 minutes and 13 seconds ago. |
It's like this: 1) for defense: spear+shield 2) for damage: two-handed weapon 3) for non-damaging attacks, no defense and less tactical options: dual-wield When you get better weapon skill, 2 one-weapon attacks approach the speed of a dual-wielding attack. Dual-wielding attack costs 800- 4*(Points in two-weapon skill) + (Maximum of the two weapons used). Usually that's 400 + (maximum of the two weapons used). So if possible, it's best to use two weapons from the category which you're most proficient with. Let's say you have lvl 12 in swords. 2 * one attack = 2*700=1400 energy. Dual-wielding it's 400+700=1100 energy. Say you have a kick-ass sword, and find a kick-ass spear, but your skill with that is only 3, not having used them much. That's 400+940=1340 energy, almost as much as 2 individual attacks with the sword! I think it's quite fast to maybe raise your spear skill to about 8-9. Then you'll be dual-attacking at 1190-1220. This isn't fast enough, IMO. Doing two single attacks @700 is MUCH better tactically, as you might get the option to retreat after a hit. Dual-wielding with grand mastery in both weapons: 995 energy. Two single attacks with GM: 1190. I'd take the two single attacks. Dual-wielding isn't even good for damage. If you want damage, use a two-handed weapon. Monster PV gets deducted from both of those dual-wielding attacks, and only once for the two-handed weapon (See molach's post on the first page). Two-handed weapons don't do double the damage, but still more or about the same as two one-handed attacks. And you get the tactical pause after every attack. Attacking PV=0, which is when dual-wielding does most damage compared to wielding a two-handed weapon, means you're fighting crappy monsters. Things you could kill by kicking while confused. That, or phase daggers. With phase daggers, you're attacking greater molochs, and then you want to retreat after every hit = no dual-wielding. Of course, Sting+Needle voids this discussion entirely. If you're feeling happy, don't worry, it'll go away. Originally posted by noob: "I'm everytime amazed how you people know to exploit every single little bug (or not-bug) for elaborated scumming tatics even if the feature seems completely useless or bad." [Edited 1 time, last edit on 11/23/2007 at 14:06 (GMT -5) by J.] |
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Jhonka Registered user Kickass player Last page view: 5363 days, 16 hours, 39 minutes and 37 seconds ago. |
Finding spears of vampirism/penetration is done easily by creating sh*tloads of spear traps in the big room and repeatedly getting hit by spears. Then just collect the non stacking spears. |
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Darren Grey Registered user Last page view: 4246 days, 16 hours, 39 minutes and 53 seconds ago. |
Er, I thought spear traps never generated prefixes or suffixes? Besides, by the time I get to the big room I'd hope to have some higher metal equipment. Waldenbrook, the dwarven shopkeeper, mumbles: "I'd offer 9 gold pieces for yer dwarven child corpse." |
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Nightmare Registered user Soul Calibur 2 Last page view: 4606 days, 6 hours, 45 minutes and 7 seconds ago. |
Wow, this is discouraging... People seem to be saying dual wielding sucks, is inneficient and pointless compared to weapon+shield or two-handed weapon. There has to be some good use for it, in some areas of the game, other than seeming cool. C'mon now, two phase daggers, two swords of sharpness, two weeping eternium spears of penetration, two hateful eternium longswords of devastation, Executor+Kinslayer... Tell me those wouldn't be FUN! All this poo-pooing of dual wielding, Drizzt Do Urden must be rolling in his grave. "As for me, I feel priveleged to be among the only species able to make scientific inquiries." -unknown "Be sure to keep your distance if you don't have resistance." -DG |
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Darren Grey Registered user Last page view: 4246 days, 16 hours, 39 minutes and 53 seconds ago. |
Needle & Sting is probably the best reason to dual wield in the game. But in a game like this you obviously want to play things pretty safe, so an unnecessary risk like dual-wielding is best avoided unless your character is somehow god-like. It is fun I'll admit - I've dual-wielded Executor and Skullcrusher when clearing a greater giant vault before. Waldenbrook, the dwarven shopkeeper, mumbles: "I'd offer 9 gold pieces for yer dwarven child corpse." |
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Subconscious Registered user Adventurer of the Human Mind Last page view: 5398 days, 15 hours, 53 minutes and 39 seconds ago. |
Hm. Have you guys really checked this correctly? I mean ranger should get +To Hit bonuses every single experience skill level and thus getting better chances to hit with dualwield! Like: one sword: +to hit bonus = +15 dual swords: +to hit bonus = +18 and +17 "The white baby dragon equips the small shield." WTF :D |
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Darren Grey Registered user Last page view: 4246 days, 16 hours, 39 minutes and 53 seconds ago. |
The problem is the energy cost. You're essentially spending two rounds at once, giving you less flexibility for healing or running away. Using two weapon combat against greater molochs is just asking for death. You have less DV, and thus open yourself up more to attacks and criticals. Whilst offence might be good, you need to have low weight weapons to have a better to hit than normal. Waldenbrook, the dwarven shopkeeper, mumbles: "I'd offer 9 gold pieces for yer dwarven child corpse." |
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