Ancient Domains Of Mystery, forum overview / Spoilers / Merchant guidelines
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Silfir Registered user Writer of Overly Long Guides Last page view: 4080 days, 23 hours, 7 minutes and 34 seconds ago. |
I think it's pretty excellent up to this point. Though you should probably explain some of the more advanced stuff (like gremlin bomb) for the reader, especially if you think it is essential stuff for a merchant to succeed. Also, the fact that merchants have a higher chance to find shops should be mentioned, somewhere in the part about class abilities. You drop the golden ball. You kick the golden ball. It slides to the west. Suddenly Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, appears! "That's not how you play Quidditch! are you even listening?" Which direction? (123456789) 4 Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is hit by a bolt of acid! Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is annihilated. You hear the ecstatic cries of a large crowd! |
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vogonpoet Registered user Last page view: 4969 days, 5 hours, 56 minutes and 8 seconds ago. |
Its probably worth pointing out alchemy based herb attack makes life for potions merchant considerably easier later on. Also, would stress delicacy of merchants in start game - Raven for me is way better than Candle - faster healing not much use if already dead. Non trollish merchants will spend much time running away to begin with. Nor can you rush into anything as merchant - patience definitely required. I might try an orc merchant next actually.... |
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Silfir Registered user Writer of Overly Long Guides Last page view: 4080 days, 23 hours, 7 minutes and 34 seconds ago. |
Candle is a lot more powerful than Raven, imho. Long Stride does almost as much as Raven, but Candle is better than Healing at 100 OR natural regeneration at max even. You drop the golden ball. You kick the golden ball. It slides to the west. Suddenly Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, appears! "That's not how you play Quidditch! are you even listening?" Which direction? (123456789) 4 Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is hit by a bolt of acid! Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is annihilated. You hear the ecstatic cries of a large crowd! |
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Soirana Registered user Chaos Freak Last page view: 4162 days, 3 hours, 42 minutes and 15 seconds ago. |
updated A root is a flower that disdains fame. Kahlil Gibran(1883-1931) |
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Ancient_pink_dragon Registered user So I was talking to a dark elf Last page view: 5720 days, 14 hours, 42 minutes and 50 seconds ago. |
Wow I actually read all of that. TO MY ADOM FILE! You attack the Ancient pink dragon with all of your force, but do not mange to harm it! The Ancient Pink Dragon breaths a deathray, poision, fire, acid, ice, lightning, water, corruption, missle, petrefication, and stun breath at you. All of your equipment is torn apart! You die... ####################################### ..-------------------------------D%$[(% ####################################### Robojesus_gintfrg St99 Le99 Wi99 Dx99 To99 Ch99 A99 Ma99 Pe99 L++ Dv/Pv 1500/1500 H -5843(18857) P 99999 (99999) Exp50/48320283474958492 ID:48374 Spd:5833 Blessed Invisible Bloated |
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Silfir Registered user Writer of Overly Long Guides Last page view: 4080 days, 23 hours, 7 minutes and 34 seconds ago. |
There's mention of "your assassin" or somesuch in the description of the Healing skill... As always, very informative, and you seem to be able to say just as much as I would say in far less words... You drop the golden ball. You kick the golden ball. It slides to the west. Suddenly Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, appears! "That's not how you play Quidditch! are you even listening?" Which direction? (123456789) 4 Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is hit by a bolt of acid! Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is annihilated. You hear the ecstatic cries of a large crowd! |
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Soirana Registered user Chaos Freak Last page view: 4162 days, 3 hours, 42 minutes and 15 seconds ago. |
yes, copy paste remains of previous guide. A root is a flower that disdains fame. Kahlil Gibran(1883-1931) |
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gut Registered user Painted this one too. Last page view: 4910 days, 42 minutes and 20 seconds ago. |
I typed up a few ideas, feel free to sift through this mess, and take or leave any part of it. A possible con for dwarves, is that most of their added skills are obtainable in-game (except mining). Also, the only race that starts out with a lower dexterity stat is troll. That plus DV reducing armor, makes them easier to hit than you might like. I know, the PV more than makes up for it in the early game, but it's worth considering. For the race evaluations, it might be worth mentioning that races that start with a higher dexterity stat, can get an extra point or two on their coin throw damage. Also for the race evaluations, gnome/troll merchants are double trained in gemology. The gemology skill seems to me, to normally train slowly. So the double training can help your PC get some extra crystals early. It would be helpful to mention the average starting PV and DV for races. I used ADOM 1.1.1 winbeta, and started at least four merchants of each race. My results were: Humans-----DV=10 PV= 0 Trolls-----DV=12 PV= 4 High elf---DV=15 PV= 0 Gray elf---DV=15 PV= 0 Dark elf---DV=14 PV= 0 Dwarf------DV= 7 PV= 5 Gnome------DV=14 PV= 3 Hurthling--DV=14 PV= 0 Drakeling--DV=13 PV= 0 Orc--------DV= 9 PV= 3 Trolls were the most inconsistant, due to inherant toughness. I had to start many of them to get an average. The rest were more consistant. Dwarves being most consistant. There is also the 'carrying large rations' trick, to get your strength stat to 18 at the start of the game. I know a lot of players don't like to 'w5' their way to a strong PC, but due to merchants starting amount of gold, perhaps it should be mentioned. This would really affect the hurthling rating though. In practice, for a hurthling merchant, strength problems can be solved as soon as reaching munxip's. >6.3.18 Acid Breath I know this isn't specific to a merchants guide, but since there were a few things about acid spit in there, here is another one to maybe add. Acid spit attack while invisible behaves like like bolt spells do. The attacked monster won't know where you are. This is very useful against an early vortex or mimic. In the talents section, consider mentioning that the 'good shot' 'keen shot' talents do benefit coin throwing. Put me in the 'fool filter', where I belong! |
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Soirana Registered user Chaos Freak Last page view: 4162 days, 3 hours, 42 minutes and 15 seconds ago. |
first version finished. comments are very wellcome. A root is a flower that disdains fame. Kahlil Gibran(1883-1931) |
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Silfir Registered user Writer of Overly Long Guides Last page view: 4080 days, 23 hours, 7 minutes and 34 seconds ago. |
Maybe you should be more clear concerning graveyard gremlin bomb? Generating a water trap on a surface level is impossible unless you know how it's done! Concerning double trained skills, I conducted a quick test: gnomish merchant - 35 gemology human merchant - 40 gemology? What gives? This seems to confirm my impression that double-training your skills is unlikely to have a major effect, if any at all! You drop the golden ball. You kick the golden ball. It slides to the west. Suddenly Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, appears! "That's not how you play Quidditch! are you even listening?" Which direction? (123456789) 4 Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is hit by a bolt of acid! Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is annihilated. You hear the ecstatic cries of a large crowd! |
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Darren Grey Registered user Last page view: 4251 days, 22 hours, 25 minutes and 24 seconds ago. |
In general with merchants I won't step beyond VD2 until I'm level 8 or so and have trained strength a bit. They really are too fragile early on to be more adventurous. Their low DV cannot stand up to ghuls or mimics, meaning a potentially very short game. Even ID is too dangerous for them early on, since a lot of out of depth monsters can be generated there. Since merchants have the least xp requirements of any class it doesn't take them long to get to level 10 just from orcs and rats. Gnomish merchants born in Cup are great for just how quickly they race through the early levels. Might be worth comparitively rating the different item specialities a bit more. Wands is great for surviving early game, but in the long run makes little difference since there are so few. Scrolls is good for having almost instant access to identify and uncursing, but later on is next to useless. Rings can be handy to save unfortunate guesswork with rings of the fish, and instant identification of important new rings like slaying and djinni summoning. Potions is by far the best, and worth scumming for in my opinion - an extra skill (and a handy one at that), and by far the largest item set to identify. Even in the mid-late game you'll be coming across new potions, and it can be handy to know straight away what they are. The coin-throwing challenge is officially called "Fling the Bling" as far as I'm aware. Never heard the "Ding! Dong!" name before. Obviously tips for this would be to max dex and get all the missile improving talents. Even then it's next to impossible - no one's ever gotten particularly far with it. Merchants have an advantage over assassins at spell-learning since they can very easily get their Le to 30 early on with CoK. However, I've found that even level 25 merchants with 30+ Learning have trouble reading basic spellbooks, and have had the likes of Cure Light Wounds books burst into flames on me. When they succeed they get a decent number of castings though. Concentration may help a little, but overall they aren't much good with spells beyond bookcasting utility spells. Waldenbrook, the dwarven shopkeeper, mumbles: "I'd offer 9 gold pieces for yer dwarven child corpse." |
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gut Registered user Painted this one too. Last page view: 4910 days, 42 minutes and 20 seconds ago. |
I did test a few human and gnome merchants, to find out if double training helps. My result is that it helps a little. Probably too little to be worth mention in the guide though. Humans at exp. level 10 had gemology at 86, gnomes at the same level were 99. Put me in the 'fool filter', where I belong! |
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Silfir Registered user Writer of Overly Long Guides Last page view: 4080 days, 23 hours, 7 minutes and 34 seconds ago. |
The difference between 99 Gemology and 86 Gemology should be hardly noticable... Double training is probably a lot more useful when it comes to Dodge. That skill seems not to get very far if you get it only due to being an elf. You drop the golden ball. You kick the golden ball. It slides to the west. Suddenly Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, appears! "That's not how you play Quidditch! are you even listening?" Which direction? (123456789) 4 Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is hit by a bolt of acid! Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is annihilated. You hear the ecstatic cries of a large crowd! |
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gut Registered user Painted this one too. Last page view: 4910 days, 42 minutes and 20 seconds ago. |
I just remembered something that should certainly be in the guide. The coin throw action costs 1080 energy points. This is very important to remember. If your enemy is one space away from you when you throw, they will often be able to travel the space AND hit you. This can happen even if your speed is slightly higher than the monsters. Put me in the 'fool filter', where I belong! |
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Darren Grey Registered user Last page view: 4251 days, 22 hours, 25 minutes and 24 seconds ago. |
Ay carumba! Never knew that - will have to be more careful with coin-tossing in future. Do the Quick/Lightning Shot talents affect cown-throwing? Minor correction to the above guide: All merchants get Literacy. The guide says most should score for it, but the manual clearly states they all get it and the wand-specialising troll merchant I just generated with 9 Le has very decent Literacy (and also 29 St and 27 To - nice for a merchant; just a pity his xp requirements are well over 4x that of my normal gnomes). Waldenbrook, the dwarven shopkeeper, mumbles: "I'd offer 9 gold pieces for yer dwarven child corpse." |
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Maelstrom Registered user The Knight of the Black Rose Last page view: 3129 days, 17 hours, 54 minutes and 36 seconds ago. |
Only 1080 energy points? My Lvl 2 hurthling merchant throws coins at 1200 energy points! A pessimist sees a dark tunnel. An optimist sees a light at the end of that tunnel. A realist sees a train. And the train driver sees three idiots on the tracks. |
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gut Registered user Painted this one too. Last page view: 4910 days, 42 minutes and 20 seconds ago. |
My grey elf merchant, was throwing at 1080 before exp. level 12. I have only the 'quick shot' talent. Put me in the 'fool filter', where I belong! |
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Soirana Registered user Chaos Freak Last page view: 4162 days, 3 hours, 42 minutes and 15 seconds ago. |
quick shot= -10%. 10% of 1200 is 120:))) so i guess these are working. A root is a flower that disdains fame. Kahlil Gibran(1883-1931) |
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Soirana Registered user Chaos Freak Last page view: 4162 days, 3 hours, 42 minutes and 15 seconds ago. |
Minor updates A root is a flower that disdains fame. Kahlil Gibran(1883-1931) |
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Molach unplugged Unregistered user |
Hey, great stuff. To the people who wanted clearer explanation of how gremlin bomb/surface gremlin bomb works...I would think that belongs in a guide of its own, like "scumming techniques" or something... I mean I could write all this in my soon-to-be-finished monk guide, or someone could do it in the beastfighter guide, or the fighter guide, or... I did not see earliest version, but I think that Soirana just referring to "gremlin bomb" would be good enough in this merchant guide. Unless there were aspects of gremlin-scumming which would apply especially to merchants. Like wall-digging is better for merchants because of their gemology. In a hypothetical bard or priest guide, one could mention that using a pet (both have music) to kill gremlins will mean they stay weak and can be exploited forever. Or in wizard/magic-user guide where one could mention that magic missile while invisible is a safe method of disposing them without destroying any stuff. Or in a thief guide one could point out that enhanced pickpocketing ability is nice when pickpocketing gremlins in the thousands. But otherwise it is pretty equal for all classes Of course, as it stand now, someone could just copy-paste the scumming entry in this guide and there we go - scumming guide well started! |
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Silfir Registered user Writer of Overly Long Guides Last page view: 4080 days, 23 hours, 7 minutes and 34 seconds ago. |
Why not have a seperate scumming guide altogether? "The Ancient Tome of the Dark Arts" or something? As long as I don't have to write it... (I could, but you'd have to be prepared for a lot of swearing and constant ridiculing of the skills of those reading it) I've also been thinking about creating an elaborate skill guide instead of including all those skill descriptions on my character guides. The way I would do that is to gather as much information as possible in forum discussions. But better not hijack this thread for that :) You drop the golden ball. You kick the golden ball. It slides to the west. Suddenly Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, appears! "That's not how you play Quidditch! are you even listening?" Which direction? (123456789) 4 Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is hit by a bolt of acid! Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is annihilated. You hear the ecstatic cries of a large crowd! |