Ancient Domains Of Mystery, forum overview / ADOM / Trouble training with Garth
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rmcin329 Registered user Last page view: 5223 days, 11 hours and 2 minutes ago. |
Hi, i've recently been having trouble trying to train my chars willpower with Garth. Its nowwhere near its maximum at 20 current 42 max(nothing altering it) yet, Garth's training has no effect on it paying even 10,000 gold and wandering for roughly 8,000 turns. Previous stat training i did took maybe, 1000-2000 turns to take effect. I've been using this site, http://www.andywlms.com/adom/adomgb-2-5.html, for amounts to pay him, and even tried overpaying him. So far i now can't get ANY stats to train up for some mysteriuos reason. Any thoughts? |
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Silfir Registered user Writer of Overly Long Guides Last page view: 4075 days, 22 hours, 58 minutes and 25 seconds ago. |
Sadly, no. I rarely use Garth. But if your willpower ist at 20, isn't morgia the better way to increase your willpower at least for the next seven levels? You drop the golden ball. You kick the golden ball. It slides to the west. Suddenly Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, appears! "That's not how you play Quidditch! are you even listening?" Which direction? (123456789) 4 Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is hit by a bolt of acid! Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is annihilated. You hear the ecstatic cries of a large crowd! |
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rmcin329 Registered user Last page view: 5223 days, 11 hours and 2 minutes ago. |
you must've misunderstood my willpower is at 20, and its max is 42. In any case this problem was finally resolved by paying Garth a whopping 12000 gold. I'm starting to suspect my race/class may be having an effect on what i have to pay him. In any case i'm just glad this isn't what i originally thought it to be.....which was a bug with using Garth for training. I suspected it to be a bug at first because i'm using the winbeta 4 version of ADOM which if you read next to it on the downloads page, it says that its still somewhat experimental. For fun heres a link you can use to get a general look at my grey elvin wizard. http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u45/rmcin329/ADOM%20screenshots/mywizardonadom.jpg But it doesn't quite reveal everything i've done on him, just some. Anywho, back to work on him. As a side note i hope to attain a Avatar of the Order ending with him. |
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J. Registered user You'll never get rid of me Last page view: 5671 days, 17 hours, 10 minutes and 35 seconds ago. |
Have you ever used put that herbalism skill to good use? Herbs have lots of positive effects. Some are bad though. A particular herb could help with that awfully low toughness of yours. If you're feeling happy, don't worry, it'll go away. Originally posted by noob: "I'm everytime amazed how you people know to exploit every single little bug (or not-bug) for elaborated scumming tatics even if the feature seems completely useless or bad." |
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Silfir Registered user Writer of Overly Long Guides Last page view: 4075 days, 22 hours, 58 minutes and 25 seconds ago. |
In what way did I misunderstand you? I know your willpower is 20. That's why I said you could use morgia roots. Also, J. is right; your toughness really could use some buffing up. In fact, congratulations on getting this far with such low HP. What are these herbs right in that level, incidentally? You drop the golden ball. You kick the golden ball. It slides to the west. Suddenly Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, appears! "That's not how you play Quidditch! are you even listening?" Which direction? (123456789) 4 Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is hit by a bolt of acid! Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is annihilated. You hear the ecstatic cries of a large crowd! |
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rmcin329 Registered user Last page view: 5223 days, 11 hours and 2 minutes ago. |
Haha getting this far with such low hp was and is very very easy actually. In any case herbs on that lvl are stomafillia/stomaceptia herbs, however i have a stable formation with morgia roots a couple lvls further down. I just recently finished collecting some, i think i'll try to train willpower/toughness with them, though from what i hear such things can't go above about 27 with herbs. With toughness it could prove annoying as the max will constantly need upping(currently maxes at 10). Another note i have is even when my tougness increases, about 9.5 times out of 10, i get 0 hp when it goes up. Another note is my herbalism is at 100. |
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Soirana Registered user Chaos Freak Last page view: 4157 days, 3 hours, 33 minutes and 6 seconds ago. |
For Garth you get stat trained for your money. Trained is not equal to increase. Spoiler
to get 100% 20 into 21 increase 22k of gold is needed A root is a flower that disdains fame. Kahlil Gibran(1883-1931) |
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gut Registered user Painted this one too. Last page view: 4905 days, 33 minutes and 11 seconds ago. |
Because you have posted in the non-spoiler forum, I will try to give non-spoily advice about experimenting with herbs. I have posted some of this in another thread already, so I will just cut and paste a bit. ------------------------------------ 1> Don't experiment with any cursed herbs. 2> Have numerous stacks of herbs before using any, as some herbs may counter the negative effects of others. 3> Identify all herbs before experimenting, look at the names of them carefully, they may give hints about their uses. 4> Have a nice inventory of potions, as some of them may also counter some undesired herb effects. 5> All herbs have some effect. If the effect of an herb isn't appearant immediately, then try using several at once, or try different methods of utilizing the herb, and note long term effects. --------------------------------------- If you find herbs that increase your stats, collect more of them than you think you will need. You may suffer some un-forseen stat draining later in the game, related to battles, corruption, or other effects. You will be happy to have extra then. Training stats beyond their maximum is not too time consuming, you will get increases periodically, and also at every exp. level up. Increasing your Toughness stat always leads to an increase in HP's, you just didn't notice it. You will surely note a big difference in your HP's as your Toughness increases to high levels. As far as training with Garth goes, some like it, but I usually spend my cash on other things. I'm no expert on training costs, as I seldom do it. However, I think if you are wearing an item that boosts your stat (for example the Willpower stat would be increased by wearing the Sword of Nonnak or an amulet of perserverance) it will screw up the training costs for that stat. Also training any stat at high levels, gets really expensive. Reguarding the herbs on the shown level. They are specifically stomafillia/stomacemptia and pepper petal/burb root, I know because I counted down from the top :) Your Mana stat is quite respectable, you must have been spellcasting your way through everything! Good luck with your game. Put me in the 'fool filter', where I belong! |
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rmcin329 Registered user Last page view: 5223 days, 11 hours and 2 minutes ago. |
Still training up toughness and willpower, and doing some other stuff too, as for the other herbs on the shown lvl(besides stomaceptia and stomafillia) i knew the burb roots and pepper petals were there i just didn't say anything, as i dont' consider then all that useful. In regards to my mana stat, it was 27 to start and yes i have been doing a lot of spellcasting. That is what wizards do ya know lol. I'm not doing what some people do which would be say using heavy armor like ring mails plate mails etc etc, or deadly weapons like say swords of sharpness spears of devesation etc etc, instead i'm trying to stay with more "wizard appropriate" items, such as robes, staffs, you know things like that. In the end if i must i'll change to heavier armors and weapons, but i don't really plan to if i don't have to. Don't really worry about spoiling anything, i already know a lot about this game, despite not having completed it yet. |
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Blacklion Registered user Jellies... BAH! Last page view: 5013 days, 4 hours, 52 minutes and 21 seconds ago. |
"Don't really worry about spoiling anything, i already know a lot about this game, despite not having completed it yet." True perhaps, but this is the spoiler-free section, and some people don't want to get spoiled, so still use spoiler-tags for spoily stuff. |
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gut Registered user Painted this one too. Last page view: 4905 days, 33 minutes and 11 seconds ago. |
Wizards have the alchemy skill, this gives every herb great potential. You may get a recipe for extra healing involving pepper petal. There also may be a way to use those burb roots offensively... Put me in the 'fool filter', where I belong! |
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J. Registered user You'll never get rid of me Last page view: 5671 days, 17 hours, 10 minutes and 35 seconds ago. |
If you could train stats with herbs, why pay garth any money at all? Isn't that just a waste of money? If you're feeling happy, don't worry, it'll go away. Originally posted by noob: "I'm everytime amazed how you people know to exploit every single little bug (or not-bug) for elaborated scumming tatics even if the feature seems completely useless or bad." |
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noob Registered user Last page view: 5936 days, 1 hour, 28 minutes and 31 seconds ago. |
Herbs don't train strength, learning, ... Also garth has theoretically no upper limit and there isn't that much to do with money in adom... |
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rmcin329 Registered user Last page view: 5223 days, 11 hours and 2 minutes ago. |
Eh i really wouldn't care if i got a recipe for extra healing, i already know cure critical wounds. Herbs will only train stats so far J. About 25.-27 from what i hear. After that no, paying Garth to train them isn't a waste of money, and as noob pointed out theres things Garth will train that herbs won't. Sadly in the case of strength it doesn't really matter as mines already maxed at 15, and natural training only "rarely" exceeds your normal limits with ease. Good thing i don't really need str all that much. Carrying stuff is no serious issue considering that i have the strength of atlas spell. In any case i'll probably put up another screenshot later today with updated willpower/toughness. Speaking of toughness....yeah i am gaining a little hp with each point of toughness.....about 1 each, meaning its still completly uselss almost. |
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Battle bunny Registered user I'm just that cool Last page view: 5834 days, 18 hours, 33 minutes and 54 seconds ago. |
Just increase toughness by... even 5 points will do. Then watch your HP rising much faster in the next levels. (\_/) (o.0) (> <) ( / \ ) Don't click this http://www.mindistortion.net/iwantyoursoul/?i_am=Darkcutter |
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rmcin329 Registered user Last page view: 5223 days, 11 hours and 2 minutes ago. |
hmmn the last point of toughness i gained(not gained any lvls yet) granted a 16 point hp boost lol. Well still more toughness to get, good thing i have plenty of blessed morgia roots. |
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rmcin329 Registered user Last page view: 5223 days, 11 hours and 2 minutes ago. |
Okay heres the promised updated screenshot of my char, after working lots on his willpower and toughness. http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u45/rmcin329/ADOM%20screenshots/mywizardonadom2.jpg Both willpower and toughness will no longer go up even eating 8 blessed morgia roots at once, so thats all the further they'll get that way. And in the case of toughness, thats all the further its going to get period(except possibly by magical potions such as gain attributes), its maxed out. Heres another screenshot, this one showing my chars potential maximums for his stats. http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u45/rmcin329/ADOM%20screenshots/alookatmywizardsstatsonadom.jpg Also can anyone tell me, from that first screenshot, if any moss of marelion are growing in there? If there is, i could put them to some use on my dexterity. |
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Battle bunny Registered user I'm just that cool Last page view: 5834 days, 18 hours, 33 minutes and 54 seconds ago. |
Woah, nice big herb pattern there! Since you have more lines than herbs, I'm sure one of the lines has a moss of marellion/whatever the other one is pair. (\_/) (o.0) (> <) ( / \ ) Don't click this http://www.mindistortion.net/iwantyoursoul/?i_am=Darkcutter |
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J. Registered user You'll never get rid of me Last page view: 5671 days, 17 hours, 10 minutes and 35 seconds ago. |
I was pretty much referring to your original post, in which you mentioned paying garth to train your willpower. That isn't money well spent IMO, as you could do the same with herbs. I usually spend a few thousand on learning to get some more skill increases, maybe even perception if it's really low, around 10, just to see a bit further. Now I see you brought up your Wi and To, good job :) From that picture I can say that yes, there is moss of marelion growing in the big room. You can check the guidebook if you want to know which row has it, or you could just find out by picking them up. Try to get as many squares as possible from that big mass of herbs, for example burn some away with firebolt to make suitable squares. If you're feeling happy, don't worry, it'll go away. Originally posted by noob: "I'm everytime amazed how you people know to exploit every single little bug (or not-bug) for elaborated scumming tatics even if the feature seems completely useless or bad." |
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Nightmare Registered user Soul Calibur 2 Last page view: 4606 days, 12 hours, 21 minutes and 29 seconds ago. |
rmcin329, keep using the herbs. You may not get stat increases with them every time, but I think it's possible to get a few more. Also, there is believed to be a limit to how many herbs you can use simultaneously which will still provide a benefit, and after that it's just a waste to continue to eat more in succession. 4 and 2 was it? "As for me, I feel priveleged to be among the only species able to make scientific inquiries." -unknown "Be sure to keep your distance if you don't have resistance." -DG |
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rmcin329 Registered user Last page view: 5223 days, 11 hours and 2 minutes ago. |
the reason i'm not bothering to eat more is that the stated limit of them, is 25, which is what my stats have reached(using blessed ones mind you) Willpower has been stuck at 25 now for i'd say the past 50 or so blessed morgia roots, that i've been using to train toughness, and yes there is a limit to how many will provide a bonus in succession, thats 8 for morgia roots. Which still has no effect at all on willpower and toughness now. I think i'll hunt around for some moss of marelion on that lvl. The 2 and 4 you were thinking of is: 2 trains toughness, 4 trains willpower and toughness. If anyones wondering how i got such a high willpower and low appearance with an elf......well i reveresed the 2 using a blessed potion of exchange. As a side note, during the whole process of training willpower and toughness to 25, willpower gained a point of maximum from 42 to 43 oddly. Anyways off to find that moss lol. |
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J. Registered user You'll never get rid of me Last page view: 5671 days, 17 hours, 10 minutes and 35 seconds ago. |
Spoily info on herbs, such as when they stop working and how to get around it: Spoiler
The herbs stop training stats at 25. This means that they don't have any effect, as in they don't work at all, if eaten/used when your wi/to/dx stat displayed at the bottom of the screen is 25. I've sometimes eaten more than 100 morgia roots with Wi/To at 25 and the stats don't increase anymore. I think you still might get a stat potential increase when you eat herbs and the stat is 25, but the stat itself won't. Sometimes it's possible to get 1 or 2 extra stat points over that strict 25 limit using herbs. Here's what you have to do: If you have the stat potential at higher than 25, eat/use LOTS (like ~100) of herbs when the stat is still at 24. Then that huge training you give the stat will give you a couple of raises, but you have to have a higher potential. So high potential, stat of 24, eat/use lots and lots of herbs, and the stat might increase beyond 25 still. Then there are of course more scummy tricks, like intentionally temporarily lowering stats to train them even higher.. Getting your character Sick! or Starving! for example. If you're feeling happy, don't worry, it'll go away. Originally posted by noob: "I'm everytime amazed how you people know to exploit every single little bug (or not-bug) for elaborated scumming tatics even if the feature seems completely useless or bad." [Edited 1 time, last edit on 1/6/2008 at 15:32 (GMT -5) by J.] |
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rmcin329 Registered user Last page view: 5223 days, 11 hours and 2 minutes ago. |
or blessing and drinking potions of gain attributes or other potions of stat increasing. I currently own 2 potions of gain attributes, but dont intend to use them till all my stats have hit their potential maxes, except for appearance. Appearance is about the only stat i really don't care for and won't use ever. The reason i'm waiting so long to bless then use the potions of gain attributes is so that i can gain an additional point beyond their current potential maximums with each of the potions, effectively boosting the stats 2 points beyond their potential maxes in my current case. It'll be well worth those extra couple extra max points i think. I still need to find and eat more ogre corpses only at 17 str(maxed). Ah well back to training dex with moss, its almost done now, being at 23. I'll probably post up a screenshot again later, showing further improved stats, and maybe another lvl or 2 gained, currently more fixiated on some stat training then lvl gaining. |
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gut Registered user Painted this one too. Last page view: 4905 days, 33 minutes and 11 seconds ago. |
In my opinion, such frank discussion of herb usage is spoily. If anyone agrees with this, they can make use of the 'spoiler' tags. Just edit your previous posts by inserting ["SPOILER"] and ["/SPOILER"] tags, at the beginning and end of the spoily parts, just remove the quotes. Or we could re-start this topic in the spoiler section. >Eh i really wouldn't care if i got a recipe for >extra healing, i already know cure critical wounds Potions of healing have some advantages over spells. Spoiler Blessed potions of extra healing can heal over 200 HP's in one turn, your spell probably won't. Your PC may also be confused by some powerful monsters (Ancient Chaos Wyrm comes to mind!) that can deal over 100 HP's of damage in one turn. You have ~1/3 chance of successfully casting a spell while confused, but a %100 chance of drinking a potion while confused. This is literally a life saver. Another useful 'R'ecipe you might get is for a potion of blindness, quite useful if thrown at the ACW. >possible from that big mass of herbs, for example >burn some away with firebolt to make suitable squares Spoiler The firebolt spell doesn't burn away herbs, the fireball spell does :) >If anyones wondering how i got such a high willpower >and low appearance with an elf......well i reveresed >the 2 using a blessed potion of exchange. I was wondering about the low appearance stat. The potions of exchange might be employed differently though, to yield even better stats. Spoiler First, pay no attention to your stat's potential maximums. I know what the manual states, but forget it. To excersise ST, obtain the !STRAINED status, and LOTS of food. Find a peaceful place and just keep pressing 'w'5. It will take some gameturns, but not much game time, and your ST will reach 18 very quickly. Excersize your WI, TO, and DE to 25 by use of herbs. Mana increases nicely with spellcasting. THEN drink the potion of exchange, in fact curse it if possible. Now repeat the training process and you should have quite respectable stats all the way around. >Sometimes it's possible to get 1 or 2 >extra stat points over that strict 25 limit Spoiler True, when your stat is at 24, regardless of the stat's maximum, you can eat/use lots of herbs for additional points. I would not reccomend eating or using more than ~20 though. KEEP those herbs, corruptions (among other things) will lower your stats as the game goes on. You can use herbs to counter those stat losses. Then when you cleanse those corruptions, your stats will be increased many points beyond thier 'maximums'. >I still need to find and eat more -[snipped]- There may be another way... Spoiler
If you use a pickaxes to dig some walls, you may find stone giants. Their corpses are pretty effective at raising your Strength stat. Because your PC doesn't have the mining skill, your pickaxe will likely break rather quickly. If you have plenty, it's no worry, but if not glod will repair them... for a price :) Put me in the 'fool filter', where I belong! |
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rmcin329 Registered user Last page view: 5223 days, 11 hours and 2 minutes ago. |
Heres yet another look at my char, with greatly updated stats(still lvl 17 too). http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u45/rmcin329/ADOM%20screenshots/mywizardonadom3.jpg Probably won't put up anything more of the sort for quite awhile, only learning appearance and perception aren't maxed. Appearance i just don't care enough about to bother(artifact mummy wrapping from pyramid is decreasing it some) Learning i could probably afford to train a few points with Garth if i wanted to, and perception, i also could use some money to train up(or other things but this isn't the spoiler area lol) On a side note, a lot(all but 1 point actually) of that mana gain since the last screenshot, has been from corpses not spell casting. So has some of those power points, those most of the power points are from mana/willpower being upped(at certain intervals both willpower and mana provide a 16 power point bonus). |