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Ancient Domains Of Mystery, forum overview / Spoilers / The prices of DT shop

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Nezur
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5466 days, 10 hours, 39 minutes and 12 seconds ago.
Posted on Sunday, June 22, 2008 at 08:43 (GMT -5)

I posted something about this at the official forum too.

Basically the Charisma of my level 14 male drakeling wizard didn't seem to affect the prices in Waldenbrook's shop. I put on a helm of leadership {Ch+6} and the prices did not chance at all. My natural Charisma score was 14.

Later I conducted a test with AdomBot (and winbeta4). Not overly accurate or comprehensive though. I generated a male human fighter. I created a blessed wand of wishing (9999 charges) and went to the Dwarftown. I wished for charisma-boosting equipment to increase my Cha by 9 and tested if it made any difference in the prices of the shop. No effect at all. The payment offered by Waldo didn't change either when trying to sell items. Then I started wishing for "Charisma" and checked the prices now and then. No effect even at ~54 Charisma. I was Lucky and Fate Smiled Upon Me at the time but I removed them at the end and that didn't change the prices. I didn't check how my Charisma affected the prices of the other shops.

Does this imply a bug or are shop prices based on the charisma/appearence value which the PC had when he/she entered the shop level for the first time?

PS: The original title of this thread was "The prices of Waldo's shop". I tried posting it numerous times before I realised that it is not possible to post threads with a title that contains apostrophes ('). Could this be changed by Jan-Erik? Additionally I'd like someone to delete my former account (the one without a space before "Nezur") since it doesn't accept my password for some reason.

[Edited 1 time, last edit on 6/22/2008 at 08:57 (GMT -5) by Nezur]
Darren Grey
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4268 days, 10 hours, 15 minutes and 29 seconds ago.
Posted on Sunday, June 22, 2008 at 10:10 (GMT -5)

I think shop prices are generated and stay stuck when you enter the level for the first time. As far as I'm aware they also change when the shop restocks. Thus it's very difficult to scum for better prices with stat raising items.

Here's a simple test you can try - savescum a char before generating dwarftown, and test sale prices with a shop generated with and without Ch/Ap boosting equipment when entering the level.
Waldenbrook, the dwarven shopkeeper, mumbles: "I'd offer 9 gold pieces for yer dwarven child corpse."
Nezur
Registered user

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5466 days, 10 hours, 39 minutes and 12 seconds ago.
Posted on Sunday, June 22, 2008 at 10:19 (GMT -5)

I'll do that.

EDIT:
A level 7 male human wizard. Charisma was increased by
wishing for it before entering the dwarf town. Initial
Charisma was 9.

Charisma 	Price offered for an eternium plate mail 
9 	4800 gp
13 	4897 gp
15 	6233 gp
17 	5516 gp
18 	6315 gp
21 	6856 gp
21 	6856 gp
23 	6856 gp


So only the Charisma that you had when you first entered the shop level is taken into account.

[Edited 1 time, last edit on 6/22/2008 at 11:21 (GMT -5) by Nezur]
Darren Grey
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4268 days, 10 hours, 15 minutes and 29 seconds ago.
Posted on Sunday, June 22, 2008 at 12:25 (GMT -5)

As I thought... Testing out whether prices are reset or not when the shop restocks would be a bit more tiresome, but I'm fairly sure I've seen prices change when that's happened before.
Waldenbrook, the dwarven shopkeeper, mumbles: "I'd offer 9 gold pieces for yer dwarven child corpse."
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Maelstrom
Registered user
The Knight of the Black Rose


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3146 days, 5 hours, 44 minutes and 41 seconds ago.
Posted on Sunday, June 22, 2008 at 15:51 (GMT -5)

Someone should check the prices for females - it seems that if you increase Ap over 25 with items (cloak and amulet), the prices acctually increase, rather then decrease.
A pessimist sees a dark tunnel.
An optimist sees a light at the end of that tunnel.
A realist sees a train.
And the train driver sees three idiots on the tracks.
Nezur
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5466 days, 10 hours, 39 minutes and 12 seconds ago.
Posted on Sunday, June 22, 2008 at 17:14 (GMT -5)

> it seems that if you increase Ap over 25 with items (cloak and amulet), the
> prices acctually increase, rather then decrease.

The effect of Appearance on shop prices has been investigated. The price you have to pay for an item keeps lowering but the payment offered by the shopkeeper for an item will start decreasing after 20 Ap. Buying and selling prices seem to "freeze" after 35 Ap.

EDIT:
> the payment offered by the shopkeeper for an
> item will start decreasing after 20 Ap.

Even after 7 Ap in one of the tests. It seems to vary.

RGRA - Pre-YAGBU / Bug report: Appearance and shop prices

RGRA - Appearance and Shop Prices -- Tonight's Testing


[Edited 1 time, last edit on 6/22/2008 at 17:42 (GMT -5) by Nezur]
Nezur
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5466 days, 10 hours, 39 minutes and 12 seconds ago.
Posted on Thursday, June 26, 2008 at 17:51 (GMT -5)

Darren Grey wrote:
> Testing out whether prices are reset or not
> when the shop restocks would be a bit more
> tiresome, but I'm fairly sure I've seen prices
> change when that's happened before.

I tested it in a casual manner.

The same char as before (a save file in which he is standing on the level before DT) and the DT shop. I nearly bought out the shop leaving only 5 items there. Took a screenshot of the prices. Then I went onto the level that was just above DT, increased my charisma by 12 by wishing and waited. After about 1k turns and at about day 2 I descended and the shop almost immediately restocked except for 5 squares and the square on which the items lay. Message: "New items seem to materialize in the shop. At the same time all price tags are exchanged." The eternium plate mail was still worth only 4800 gp according to the shopkeeper when I tried to sell it. The items I had left in the shop actually cost about 70% MORE despite my Cha value of 21.

In another test with the same character I noted that the prices seem to change (~41% more in the test) even without any change in the Charisma of the character.

The multiplier used for items when the shop was restocked was the same ie. prices were not multiplied independently by different factors at the time of restocking.

EDIT: Clarified the last paragraph.


[Edited 1 time, last edit on 6/26/2008 at 19:28 (GMT -5) by Nezur]
Darren Grey
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4268 days, 10 hours, 15 minutes and 29 seconds ago.
Posted on Thursday, June 26, 2008 at 18:47 (GMT -5)

Okay, Ch and Ap really are just entirely useless then. If they can only make a difference when generating the shop then they are incredibly limited.
Waldenbrook, the dwarven shopkeeper, mumbles: "I'd offer 9 gold pieces for yer dwarven child corpse."
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gut
Registered user
Painted this one too.


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4926 days, 12 hours, 32 minutes and 25 seconds ago.
Posted on Friday, June 27, 2008 at 00:12 (GMT -5)

I think Ap does make a difference. I seem to
remember equipping +Ap items, and getting better
prices as a female PC. Perhaps Ch just doesn't
work in the same way. It's possible that Ch is
linked with the haggling skill, possibly lowering
the point at which the shopkeeper will give the
'sorry, my 87 kids you know' line.
Put me in the 'fool filter', where I belong!
Darren Grey
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4268 days, 10 hours, 15 minutes and 29 seconds ago.
Posted on Friday, June 27, 2008 at 12:21 (GMT -5)

Well I remember equipping +Ap items with a female PC and getting no difference. Heh, perhaps another test is in order...
Waldenbrook, the dwarven shopkeeper, mumbles: "I'd offer 9 gold pieces for yer dwarven child corpse."
Silfir
Registered user
Writer of Overly Long Guides


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4097 days, 10 hours, 57 minutes and 39 seconds ago.
Posted on Sunday, June 29, 2008 at 11:09 (GMT -5)

I equipped +Ap items and got better prices too. There's apparently parameters we do not yet know.
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You kick the golden ball. It slides to the west.
Suddenly Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, appears! "That's not how you play Quidditch! are you even listening?"
Which direction? (123456789) 4
Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is hit by a bolt of acid! Harry Potter, the apprentice wizard, is annihilated.
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Evil Knievel
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5466 days, 1 hour, 27 minutes and 40 seconds ago.
Posted on Tuesday, July 15, 2008 at 06:28 (GMT -5)

"I, at any rate, am convinced that He does not throw dice."

or Adom is just non-deterministic?

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