Ancient Domains Of Mystery, forum overview / General / Atheism and Church vs. State
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DaN Registered user Cursed and Doomed Last page view: 6993 days, 10 hours, 51 minutes and 48 seconds ago. |
as far as carefully wording my posts is concerned, it ain't gunna happen. if we communicated in pictures that would be fine. anyway, bring back the momentary tongue-in-cheek, i liked that also, there was this article in the Guardian today comparing religion to class A drugs ("more e vicar?"). "Religion - Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism etc, etc - is by definition irrational and, more than that, it is an irrationality that lays claim to the complete truth. How dangerous is that?" full story [Edited 2 times, last edit on 9/17/2003 at 19:18 (GMT -5) by DaN] |
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Iridia Moderator on this forum YASD Last page view: 3758 days, 3 hours, 6 minutes and 3 seconds ago. |
Heh. Dangerous... yes. Any claim to absolute truth is dangerous. The question is whether or not that claim is valid. Die Gedanken sind Frei |
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Lamaros Registered user The sieve Last page view: 7171 days, 5 hours, 30 minutes and 48 seconds ago. |
Re: Fundamentalism I would say I was fundamentalist in regards to the scope of this discussion.. but if we decide to have a conversation where we all try to convert each other I have no problem. I felt like the conversation ceased to be an exchange, and I didn't want to participate in that type of conversation, so I was annoyed. My fundamentalist response. I don't think that makes me a fundamentalist though. Hrm, I just noticed how close the word conversation is to conversion.. I guess I've not really understood the point of conversation all these years... With all these posts flying about it's easy to get a little confused, so I have no doubt I'm coming across hypocritical. |
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Lavos Registered user Cardiovascular Endurance Last page view: 7098 days, 15 hours, 21 minutes and 10 seconds ago. |
...Christ died for "our" sins. Thus someone had to finger him - whether it was the Jews or the Romans - and whoever did should then surely be congratulated by Christians for arranging the set-piece that gave birth to their religion. Except that God must have arranged his son's death because He arranges everything. Or does He? i think God sets up things (as i said earlier) in a way that it all works together, because of the kind of person you are. Read that part. it hardly makes sense if you look closely. BTW, i wrote a long post, but it got messed up and deleted (CTRL + C!!!!) so this isnt as long as it would be. if anyone has any PROOF that a god of any kind cannot exist, please post it, i would like to see... (: |
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Lamaros Registered user The sieve Last page view: 7171 days, 5 hours, 30 minutes and 48 seconds ago. |
I'd ask someone to post proof that God does exist if they had it, but I'm sure I've gone through most of the major arguments already. Better thing to do though: Would those you you that believe in God care to define 'it' for me? |
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Iridia Moderator on this forum YASD Last page view: 3758 days, 3 hours, 6 minutes and 3 seconds ago. |
I think we've ALL gone through all the major arguments on here... we've been going in circles lately. Not much progress to be made, or new information to be given, that way. If I had my way about it, we'd try not to talk about religion until someone (me included... I'm probably one of the worst about it) had something new to say... *sigh* Too many tests. Don't wanna think if I don't have to.. Die Gedanken sind Frei |
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Caladriel Registered user ReGiStErEd UsEr Last page view: 4699 days, 12 hours, 43 minutes and 33 seconds ago. |
:-D I'm on a mission, but I will pull this into a side thread: Trap Iridia Day |
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Caladriel Registered user ReGiStErEd UsEr Last page view: 4699 days, 12 hours, 43 minutes and 33 seconds ago. |
DaN: I would say that the danger is not from claiming an absolute truth/morality exists, but, rather, I would say the danger is from claiming to know, or claiming to be fully aware of, this absolute truth/morality. [Edited 1 time, last edit on 9/18/2003 at 18:14 (GMT -5) by Caladriel] |
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Caladriel Registered user ReGiStErEd UsEr Last page view: 4699 days, 12 hours, 43 minutes and 33 seconds ago. |
Lavos: Personally, I do not think God arranges everything like a master puppeteer. I think God works with what we give It, just as we work with what It gives us. ie. God did not make the people crucify Jesus. That was a choice that they made. Had they chosen not to crucify him, then I think It would have brought about Its purposes some other way. |
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Caladriel Registered user ReGiStErEd UsEr Last page view: 4699 days, 12 hours, 43 minutes and 33 seconds ago. |
Lavos: BTW, "the Jews" did not have Jesus executed any more than "the Arabs" blew up the Twin Towers. Jesus, his desciples and all his followers were Jewish. Unfortunately, as I understand it, when John was writing his gospel, the power of the Jewish priesthood was in decline -- due to the failure of the revolts -- and the various Jewish factions (of which Chritianity was one) were in competition for the hearts of the people. The primary group in competition with Christianity was Rabbinical Judaism. It wasn't until the Rabbis won the market share that Christians started thinking in terms of us Christians vs them Jews. I think that is why John's gospel has such dark insinuations about Jews and focuses so much on the Pharisees (Rabbi's), when, in fact, they were not that prominant at the time of Jesus' teachings. |
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Taz Registered user Registered user Last page view: 5027 days, 21 hours, 18 minutes and 46 seconds ago. |
Only sped-read the first and last page of this thread, so I apologize if I say anything that's been said before. I dont believe in God as the Bible describes it. I think that it's a bit too exaggerated and extreme. But I still believe that there is something out there that created all of us. I think that we'd be too presumptuous to think that 'It' created the whole universe and then focused 'Its' attention only on us humans. It might probably not even be a rational/thinking being. About morality: I think that it's an interesting idea. I did the IB TOK, which is sort of like a philosophy class, and I have this article called "Give War a Chance". It explains how war helps us control population, preventing famine, overpopulation, etc. There's this other articles that talks about morality and how us humans insist on trying to save every single life we can, even if it means that the person you saved will suffer while they live. So, what is morality? How do we know what is the right thing to do? And what if it's 'right' for the whole world, but 'wrong'/unfair for one person? Thoughts are a bit jumbled now, too sleepy to bother to think sentences/arguments through properly :p And I also think that this is slightly OT from Church :D Taz: A potion of gain attributes (4s) is lying here. Suddenly a stone block hits your head! Something on the ground is smashed to pieces! PeanutGod: Awwww no! How harsh is that! This is where you need the artefact 'mop and bucket'. |
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Caladriel Registered user ReGiStErEd UsEr Last page view: 4699 days, 12 hours, 43 minutes and 33 seconds ago. |
Lamaros: That is such a broad topic, and this thread has become too long (IMHO). I am going to break this out into What is God |
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Caladriel Registered user ReGiStErEd UsEr Last page view: 4699 days, 12 hours, 43 minutes and 33 seconds ago. |
Taz: I am going to copy your post to What is God DaN, I'll also pull over your Morality thread to there. [Edited 1 time, last edit on 9/18/2003 at 18:23 (GMT -5) by Caladriel] |
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Lavos Registered user Cardiovascular Endurance Last page view: 7098 days, 15 hours, 21 minutes and 10 seconds ago. |
errr... when did i say 'puppeteer?' thats not what i was saying. we are made a way. and in that way, things will happen. (: |
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Caladriel Registered user ReGiStErEd UsEr Last page view: 4699 days, 12 hours, 43 minutes and 33 seconds ago. |
Lavos: I am going to copy your post to What is God |
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Taz Registered user Registered user Last page view: 5027 days, 21 hours, 18 minutes and 46 seconds ago. |
Copy/pasting everything into a new thread won't help much ;) Does Jan deletes old, inactive threads? Taz: A potion of gain attributes (4s) is lying here. Suddenly a stone block hits your head! Something on the ground is smashed to pieces! PeanutGod: Awwww no! How harsh is that! This is where you need the artefact 'mop and bucket'. |
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C<U> Unregistered user |
Taz, I agree with you on the Bible/God idea. |
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